Ep. 19: How to Reach the Top (and Stay There)—Inside Kenny Platt's Family-run Cutting Operation

Hi, everyone. This is Melanie Smith with the Business of Horses. We have a very exciting family here today that is close to our hearts. Kenny Platt, Becca Platt, Carter Platt are all here with us. First of all, we're celebrating fresh off of a win at the Super Stakes with LBR Hingham. He won, finally got his title down there. It was his turn, right? That's what I was like, it's his turn. We loved who we were co-champ with last time, but we were ready for him to be. He kind of got it all on his own. He wanted to get him all on his own. But Kenny, you had a phenomenal Friday, won $238,000 in the finals between the four- and the five-year-old, I think, or four-year-old and the five-, six-year-old. Yep.

Absolutely unbelievable. And I know that, you know, that's you and your entire team, which Becca and Carter, I know, are critically important to that team. Absolutely. And so today what we are going to do is talk a little bit about just making it as a trainer in the cutting horse industry. We all know, no matter whether you are coming into this industry trying to make it as a trainer, whether that's cutting horses, reining horses, two-year-old guy, rope horse trainer, whatever it is, that presents its own unique challenges for every single person. And I know you have a great story and, and, you know, have gotten for now you have this incredible string of horses. And I think that's what every young trainer hopes to grow up and have like, I have to pinch myself sometimes and you guys probably do too.

When you have those really early mornings and late five, this is the dream that I dreamed up. We couldn't have hand wrote this dream, you know, after Friday, couldn't hand write 20 years ago. This is what it's going to be like. We're all collectively at this table. We should be so grateful for what we do have. But I think, you know, a young trainer looks at. Kenny you and your family and says like this is what I want that's what I want to do one day so I kind of want to walk through your career from the very beginning Becca your life from the very beginning kind of what brought you guys together how Carter came through and I know he runs the whole business now so like we've you know we've got to we've got to explain how Carter makes everything go around today and and just what it took to hit that you know you've gone through so many peaks and valleys to get over that kind of peak and start to have that consistency where you have the horses it takes to win so kenny i'll start with you just let's talk a little bit about childhood did you ride horses your family yeah i really didn't start i didn't really start riding a lot until i was about carter's age like eight or nine and my mom really got me involved in cutting.

And and i kind of got to borrow i didn't kind of i borrowed a horse my mom borrowed a horse for me to start showing when I was about eight or nine years old called Doc's Accident, who was originally trained by Larry Reader and was kind of sitting around because he was sort of tied up in a, kind of a funny deal, but he's tied up in like a court case kind of a deal. And my mom was, you know, done great for herself, but really a person of normal, very much normal means and didn't have, we didn't really have like the, hey, let's go buy a horse because you want to get started it was kind of more borrow one and and she had a nice horse that she was getting started with too and and you know. I really got to give her the majority of the credit, you know what I mean?

Because without her, like, I mean, because Carver's eight years old. I was nine years old, and I said I wanted to try to do this. And she could have gone about it like, oh, you know, until you really get serious. And she's like, no, here's a horse, got me set up with some lessons and stuff like that. You were in Colorado? Yeah. Okay. So where were you raised at? And basically like Millican, Fort Lupton, Platteville, Greeley, that area. And so who were you riding with at the time? Our neighbors had a couple of Australian guys working for them that had kind of been around cutting and ridden with Paul Hansman. And the main one is Andrew Lyons. And that's who I, you know. Basically would just go across the street and take some cutting lessons.

And that's where that horse was, that Doc's accident that I kind of got started riding was there and stuff like that. So we got to take that horse home, take care of it as kind of part of the deal. And I got to take lessons on him and stuff like that. So where and so that your lessons went on until what age you think where you were starting to do some different things whether it was low for the trainer i would uh i i my parents were split up you know so i live with my dad during the week and i went to school in greely and uh i would on the weekends you know i got to usually take like one lesson and then we would go to a cutting where i would take a couple lessons on friday and saturday and and stuff like that so it wasn't you know it wasn't like these kids do it now i mean or like he gets to do it it was it was very much pretty pretty sparingly you know like like a normal very much a normal person would be able to do it you're you know let's say we're we're 20 years ago from now you're riding a little bit of whatever that somebody will pay you to ride yeah when do you think you kind of hit that spot where you're like okay now i'm starting to get some cutting horses that i'm getting to go show a little bit because you had a little different path here because most people and you know they get through with high school or college or whatever and they go to work for somebody right two-year-old So yours was different.

Yeah, which I think is great that people do that. I think that you really shouldn't go to work for somebody very good. You know, I kind of worked with people. A lot and I was fortunate that I got started really young and I didn't go to regular school you know I was homeschooled and I got a lot of experience in that way but I I'm not knocking the go to work for somebody you really respect and and learn you know I think I wouldn't necessarily recommend doing it the way I did it at all it just it just was how I did it and it worked for me what how do you think you were whenever you started going and like kind of having serious. I want to say it was at about 2007 to 2008, because I sold a really nice gelding to a guy named Dwight Fisher, who was from Canada, and he was working in Denver.

And I had a really nice smart little lean of gelding that I owned, that I was showing and doing good on, and I sold in that horse. And that kind of got a relationship started with that guy, who actually ended up owning some really nice horses that I had. One of them was a mare called Smart and a doc. And then he owned a horse I won that limited open fraternity on in 2010 called Downtown Smart. So he was a first kind of real customer for me and along with like I mentioned Hank and Karen True there in the early stages. And during kind of that time, I got to riding horses for a guy named Robert Trugamba, who I still ride horses for now, who owned the gelding I was third on the other night. And that relationship, through that relationship, I ended up buying my place.

His son owned a place, and then they sold the place to me. And anyway, that kind of got that kind of rolling. Yeah, yeah. And that's one thing I think is important for people to hear and see. Because I think as a horse trainer, it's really important that you try and get a place bought. Yes. At some point in your career. And I was talking to Matt Gaines about this. But, you know, he was asking me, I brought a horse for him to look at about, I don't know, it's been eight or nine years ago, maybe, maybe not that long ago, probably a good six years ago. And he was asking me about what I have changed between then to now. And, you know, my, my place, I've been able to build the right stuff and cow pens and facilities and, and keep enough cattle around to really, really get horses worked kind of how, how I think they need to be worked.

And my place has really helped me. In the beginning, it was horrible, you know, because you're starving enough and you're trying to buy loads of pipe and sell a horse so you can get your buddy to help you build the right facility and stuff. In the beginning, it was very, very difficult. But having my place has really given me just a, you know what I mean? Somewhere to go back to that's home. That's you. Yeah, and that somebody can't kick your ass out. And financially, too, I think it just makes you, I mean, I'm sure there's no telling what it's worth now comparatively to what you paid for it. A lot, a lot more. Yeah. So that gives you that cushion that is so important. And I don't care what anybody says.

I think in your headspace, there's something to be said for that, knowing just having that confidence that you know that, you know, you do have a soft landing. If something were to happen, you've got an asset that can be sold or, you know, something you can get some equity out of. Yeah. Okay, so now let's talk about, Becca, kind of how you grew up and, you know, how you were involved in the horses and then how that led you and Kenny to get together. How I met Kenny was Kenny's mom had some English horses, and she would come to this barn and take lessons. And so I met Paula first. And so I remember, and I'm older than Kenny, everybody knows that. But I remember seeing him ride, you know, I think at the time he was just, he did have some cutters that he and his mom owned.

But I can't remember, it was something that I think his mom raised that he was starting. But i just remember thinking he was one of the most talented people around a horse i'd ever seen. And i'm pretty you know i feel like i have a good eye for that because i had a high standard for how i wanted horses handled for how i did things and i was amazed by the talent that i saw in him and i just you know so it's been a slow climb but you know i knew like we both started at the very just For any young man listening, women love cowboys. Always remember. Always remember. All of us. Always. You can be a race car driver, a lot of other things, but women love cowboys. So how long have you guys been married for?

Well, we got married in 2017 when Carter, before Carter was born. But we've been together. Nine years. But we've been together a lot longer. Yeah. Yeah, so. Nice. Nice. And so, okay, so then Carter comes along, we get the boss, he's bored, starts managing it. Yeah, just immediately. Yeah, if you want to know the key to success, it's Carter. Yeah, that's right. Okay, so you guys are together. Clearly, you know, let's just say we're in 2010. So what is that, 16 years ago? 2010, 2015, that kind of stage. Are you starting to go to some age events at that point? Yeah, I got to go, you know, I got to go to some, like, ones that made sense, you know what I mean? I'm like, yeah, like around 2009 and 10, I was getting to where I had like a little string of some horses that.

It was the first year you went to the Idaho fraternity. I want to say that was in 2008. I was thinking that was like one of the. Yeah. Because back in the time, at that time, the Idaho fraternity, it was a big, it was a big event. Yeah. Tons of people. Canadians. It was 103 rules. I remember that. For a small fraternity. Yeah. I remember I got to go up there, and I only got to go up there because I was like, oh, we should go to that fraternity before, like, social media and all that, and I'm like, it looks like it paced pretty good, and I had a really nice small fraternity horse that year and some other horses, and, yeah, so that was in 2008. How did you know, though, that, you know, if that's the first kind of age of it? Yeah.

Like, bigger age, do we go to? Like, what went through your mind that you said, okay, I'm ready to go? Like, did you feel prepared, or were you like, it didn't? Step yeah I just think it I don't know I mean I've kind of always paid attention enough you know what I mean and I think I looked at the results and I saw there was a bunch of people there that were good the year before and and I had a small fraternity horse that cut pretty good and I'd trained some other small fraternity horses along the way and and and yeah I had a couple a couple two three pretty nice horses and you know honestly I just you just spent what yeah I just went and And I've always kind of had that mentality of like, I mean, I'm not scared to just go try.

Sure. You know what I mean? And, yeah, I don't know. Some of those questions people have asked me just too recently and they're like, how did you? I'm like, I have no idea. Or were Dwayne Fisher on to go? Yeah, yeah. I got a customer who wanted to go too. And it was kind of a big, there was a lot of, I think, pride in those Canadians. even though he was living in Denver, working in Denver, lots of Canadians would come to that show. And I think at the time it was kind of a, it was kind of the spot to be for those, you know, for people to come, you know, from everywhere, especially Ken. And I think he, he's really the one that kind of encouraged Kenny to go. And so that was kind of our first person was like, well, let's.

Had a pretty good sponsor. You know, it's like, when you go to dinner at a really nice restaurant, it's good to have a sponsor. Yeah. My people, there was an expectation there, but I'd trained some other horses. You showed a lot. I mean, we would go to the worst. Yeah. We would go to some pretty bad cutting. I don't think you showed a lot at this point. Yeah. I think I want to say when I'd won the limited open fraternity in 2010, I'd already won a couple hundred thousand, $200. The hard way. Yeah, $200 at a time. And, and, and yeah, I will say that like, to like young people want to know if they're ready or not, like, you know, you're. Preparation is key like i mean you need to go to some small shows and you need to you know get your ass handed to you by somebody you don't think is as good a hand as you yeah and then figure out why that guy is beating you if you don't think he's as good as you then why why is he beating you and and and figure the the the lowest part out right like like the the lowest level like and until you could really compete and win on on the on the lowest like a club cutting weekend show small level yeah until you can figure out how to win on that level then then you get to go to the next level wasn't so much that you went and worked side by side with the trainer it was more you knocked it out at the weekend shows yeah learning going watching cows turning back helping customers whatever it may be yeah and once you felt like you had some level of confidence there and clearly your customer had confidence in you and the horses you were training then it was time to take step one to the first stage of it. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, I would say that that's pretty accurate. Yeah. I had some customers that weren't necessarily easy to get along with and they weren't really all that nice. And, and, you know, you got to go through that too, right? Like you got to have a customer tell you that they don't think you're good enough and that they think you could do better and that you're not as good as that other person. And to kind of make you be like, well, okay you know so so we had a podcast earlier this morning that will go on before this for two-year-old programs so some people are going to be listening to this and have already listened to the one about two-year-old programs but we talked in there a lot about customer expectations.

And one thing we got into that i thought was really interesting and it's so true is how many really incredible horse trainers we have that are such bad people persons, I guess is the way to say it. Like they don't have good people skills. And sometimes this just don't go hand in hand. Yeah. You have managed customers really well. I think you are really good at managing people. And how do you think, besides, or maybe that is the answer, you just figured it out. Did you learn to manage those expectations? How did you keep your confidence up while taking those steps? I wanted to be a winner, you know, and every step that I made with a customer was never trying to lift a dollar off of them. It was trying to win.

It was trying to get them to send that horse to the next cutting that I thought I could go do good at. It was trying to get them to buy me a better horse. And, I mean, I've made deals upon deals, and I've lost money going to horse shows. More times I've sold saddles to enter horses. I've done all of that stuff and I think people the right people saw that in me and on me that it wasn't really about the money it is about the money I mean you have to make a living you have to make a living and and I've had some great windfalls but it's always come from that attitude of you know I wanted to win and I wasn't scared to leverage something or you know maybe write a questionable check you know looking in hindsight or or do whatever it was to to get that step and i think people even like don ham sending me lbr hang them you know you know i think i think people saw that part of me that i was really doing it from for the love of doing this and wanting to win and and i think that weeded the people out that that that whatever yeah or that didn't that you know didn't believe in me like and and i i've never been scared to just level with people and tell them the truth whether it was what they really wanted to hear or not and and that has i wouldn't say to run people off but it has made people go other places but i've had people i call it boomerang i've had him come right back because they're like well at least this guy told me the truth horse may have not been good enough but at least i knew because he told me or horse may not been good enough but this guy tried way harder than any of these other people to do to to achieve success and so yeah i don't know if that answered that question well i think so you brought up some things in there I want to talk about and.

You know, you said the boomerang effect. We see that here. And Ty, for me, I used to take it so personal. If somebody took their horses somewhere else or something, it's just like, I was just like, oh my gosh, what did we do wrong? What could we have done better? Like, it would lose sleep over at night. And I think as time goes on and you get more confidence in yourself and your program, it's no different with me versus you guys as horse trainers or us with a breeding program. Like, you get confidence in what you've got going. And but those, Ty always said it. And ty's like the ultimate cheerleader right like he's really good at that for anybody for a young horse trainer whether it's me the people that are part of our team here he's like the best cheerleader and always positive about it but very straightforward he would always be like listen if we're doing it right which we are they'll come back 100 they they always come back and now that i'm you know we're eight years into solo i can't tell you how many times that's happened and we've done him a good job but you know it's just like with you guys somebody gets in their ear and says hey i can do a better job or i can do this or i can do it cheaper i can you know whatever and you're like just go like it's okay like it's not any hard feelings i don't sleep it over at night anymore and you shouldn't either and just go and i'm sure it's the same thing with you guys you know if you're doing a good job they're gonna come back right yeah and and ultimately if they know it then it's they weren't the right customer customer anyway and and i think there's there's yeah there's a lot to be said to that i'm not one one thing about to always feel like i've had i mean there's people out there that work i'm sure they work harder than me i'm sure there's hard.

You know but my work ethic's always been good i'm gonna work your horse like i'm gonna ride your horse myself i'm gonna know what's going on with it and stuff like that and and if if if you've got a good work ethic and you're in touch with your business and you know what's going on with those horses if you tell somebody it's it's not a good enough horse. For one, they should believe you, but for two, you're usually right. And that's just part of it. Well, and I think, especially here, but with you guys' stuff too, it's like, if you're riding a horse and when they come, their horse looks good. Your place is cleaned up. You know, you look like you peered. That matters a lot to people. I told a guy the other day, and you'll know who he is when he listens to this, but he was showing this horse, you know, it didn't go very good.

And he asked me what he should do differently. and i mean i told him a variety of things but one of them was to like get a haircut and get it you know get it together yeah because you look like you're at a junior rodeo yeah sure it didn't matter we're not going for that and that's the same thing as what you're saying you need to clean your place up and things need to look sharp and good and and you don't have to have a fancy place i mean our place has it's gotten fancy now but it didn't start out that way but between my wife and I and several other customers helping us fix it up that it, you know, when I first got started, it was always well-maintained and clean, but it wasn't, you know, certainly wasn't this, that's for sure. Yeah.

Well, same thing here. I mean, if Ty and I bought that place in Whitesboro and you wouldn't have brought one customer there the day we bought the stalls, I mean, it was a wreck, you know, and it was just. Like you said, you're just hoping the checks don't bounce and you can order enough pipe that week and pay the welders to start building because you need more stalls because it's more, more, more, more. And that is, you know, you're going into a completely blind. I've always said like the best thing you can do is just feel like you're broke all the time. I think so. I think, yeah, I think there's nothing more motivating than when it's like that to me. Like when when we bought our place and stuff like that i mean it was i would look out there and i would see all the stuff i need to do and i would just put my shoes on and just go surf doing it and you know what i mean there's a level of anxiety that that creates that turns you into a powerhouse human that you aren't if you don't if there's not that soft place to land and i think it's a necessary part of whether you talk about horse training or owning a business or working you know having a job that expects a lot of you it creates a level of maybe anxiety is not the right word but you know that you're like i better get this done yeah there's no there's no backup yeah and there's no safety net yeah there's no no backup plan is the best best way to have it i think it's that breeds as much success as anything so okay so you've got you've gotten to.

What happens next you go to idaho and then where do you think the ball starts rolling where you're starting to say okay now i've got good enough horses and i'm showing good enough to start going to more aged events yeah probably right around and then you know like i kind of started being able to go to like the utah fraternity and and the wyoming fraternity and we used to go to the brass fraternity those those fall fraterities you know that that really kind of got me going starting to to train horses and go show them and stuff and and i would say winning the limited open fraternity in 2010 and then I bought my place and and right right around and then is when it really kind of got rolling like turned yeah there was a pretty good lull there though I mean like I lost pretty good customer like right about the time I bought my place and things got a little weird and scary there for a minute and I didn't have that many horses in training for how many horses do you think you were had and on average in training at that time probably about 20 to 25 Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. And so one thing that I think a lot of people don't talk about, but I think is really important. And I don't I think Becca does this. So this might be a Becca question, but. The time and growth it takes on the back end to manage that business from. Hey, we're just going to go show to, hey, we've got to either we got to get the customers to write the check or we got to write the check for these entry fees. And we got to front. Now, all of a sudden, you've got to have enough money to front these fuel and shavings and stalls and expenses. And then now you're in a whole full-fledged business. And how did you guys figure out the financial side of it as far as a cash flow and billing and logistics perspective?

I felt like I sweated it for a long time because we bought our place from Bob Tregemba. He owner carried it, but the mortgage came off that train and delivery month. So that was a huge chunk of cash flow we did not have. And in the long run, of course, it's great because we haven't placed, but we sweated it for a long time. A long time, like years. Yeah, I mean. I would say from 2000, I mean, I remember it was pretty, it was from 2010 when I bought that place to about the end of the middle of 2016. Yeah. Because we were building, we were trying to build more infrastructure because it didn't have infrastructure. And it's no exaggeration Kenny would sell anything on that place that wasn't, cemented in there I mean he'd be out there taking pictures of the sheds that were left he didn't like panels I mean anything that was not attached we were he was selling which that I give Kenny a lot of credit in the fact that.

Even if he has fear, he doesn't show it. Yeah. So he just, he's a risk taker where I'm not. And he's like, I will make this work. Yeah. So if I have to sell this whole load of panels to be able to buy a couple stalls or, you know, and I remember when we built our bigger barn that has 18 stalls. It's no exaggeration. We had some stalls at Kenny's Moms that we had in our indoor that we'd used. So we owned ourselves, what, about eight stalls? I'd say eight. And we put those in that big barn. We did the concrete, you know, alleyway, the back wall, and we put those eight stalls in. And as we could afford it, we would put one stall in at a time. That's so cool. And I mean, that's the God's honest truth.

So at one end of the morning, the stalls are older and the other. But I mean, that's how it went. So that was our management of it is that we just had to work within the limits of what we had. Because we didn't have, besides Bob, who was a financial backer, but he still needed his money every month. Sure, yeah. So I feel like. We had to do it one painstaking step at a time. For, I mean, really, and until I got a really good account in about 2019, it was like one step forward, three steps back kind of a thing. And, you know, I was buying some horses in about 2016, 2017, because we'd struggled for so long. Like, I'd finally gotten a little bit of capital just from winning. Like, I won the Super Stakes in the Derby that year and I had a little extra money.

What course was that that you wanted? mom stylish player yeah i want to talk about him when you're yeah i would love to talk about him and uh and it you know from winning those it freed me up a little bit of income to where i i was able to kind of buy just some trading horses and some buy and sell some other stuff and horse wise and and and and then it really wasn't until about 2019 that we got a really good accountant because i had not a very good accountant prior to that that caused a lot of problems but getting a better accountant just i mean it like saved my life really i mean rachel walkie she's a great lady and i mean she started giving me some financial advice that was just pivotal and and really helped me make a lot more money and you know changed our lives a lot so so i want to dig into some of that a little bit more because i think this is the stuff that people don't talk about especially for these young trainers when they're just like what i don't know like what do i just fill them on QuickBooks? Do I just, I don't know.

Like I get one trainer, God bless his soul, sends me a handwritten one line bill every month. And I'm like, we got to get it together. We're too good to hold. I'm sure I didn't be good at this, you know, but I mean, it works for him. But I want you guys to tell us a little bit, like if you could give the advice to somebody that is trying to start out with this, you know, you talk about before you didn't have an accountant and then you hired one. And what was a bad accountant and what made this one a good one? And what do they do for, Oh, I mean, okay, well, when we hired Rachel, you know, I had an accountant. And did they do your books every month? They're like, what did they do? They just did our yearly table and half.

That's it. So Becca, you were handling the day that they like, we have enough money to go to this first show or you better sell a sow. Yeah, sell some new stuff. So, I mean, for me, what it was was like, I mean, I need, as a horse trainer, you need someone to sort you out. Yes. I mean, it's that simple, like, I don't have the time to do it. But I mean, if I do have the time to do it, most times that is sleepy time. So I mean, that's about the only time you get to rest. So I need someone to sort me out. And, you know, Beck was doing a great job billing people and stuff like that. But then on my accountant's end, he wasn't saying, hey, you need to buy a new pickup or, hey, you know, you need to do this or we need to write this off.

You know, I was basically at the end of the year, I'd have 40,000 in my bank account and he'd be telling me that I need to pay the government 60. And you know and yeah and it got me really really bad behind and because i had made some money and i they weren't staying up with things i had a tax lien for a lot of money and that was very stressful because for those listening if you do get behind on your taxes printing you know war strainers listening that the irs can go into your account and just take ten thousand dollars and they send you some mean letters and some and after they're done sending you those mean letters They just go in there and take their money. And I had a little bit of that. I had a lot of that going on.

And it wasn't like we were not doing it. No. Because we had this accountant. And I kept telling our accountant, I'm like, You are missing deductions of some sort. Something is wrong. For sure. Because, and when we hired Rachel, she found all, they had never depreciated. Oh, my God. A pile of that. I mean, serious stuff that they missed. And she's like, oh, boy. You know, so. 2019 was probably an amazing year for you. I mean, when she was like, well, you guys are going to get a bunch of money. Yeah. Because your guy has missed so much stuff. Oh, my goodness. So, it was. Yeah. And that year was like, it's funny how, you know, you got to go through. A lot of you gotta suffer like it's just part of just part of it you can't read a book or listen to this and just skip all those things maybe we can save you a couple of them but you just suffering is part of it yeah that's what makes it better i sold a horse that year called his name's my pistol's hot and i bought that horse the previous year.

I think I paid $12,000. As a yearling. Yeah, I bought me a yearling for $12,000, and I sold them for a lot more than that. And right around that time, I got this accountant, and it was like for the first time ever, like I had some. And I mean, it wasn't a lot of money either. It wasn't like the new normal, which is everybody sells a million dollars. Sure. But it was like some life-changing money for us and gave me some breathing room, and it gave me some capital to buy some more horses and stuff. And I always tell people, you know, I think I ended up netting $60,000 off of that. Which sounds like nothing compared to how great a horse that horse is, but that 60,000 helped me make a couple million dollars because I feel like that works without that and without my accountant and stuff.

And it just allowed us to really get ahead and it changed. It changed that time right in there. It changed my life. Yeah. I mean, essentially it made it to where I got a lot better at this part of it to the showing part of it and not because I wasn't as stressed out. I remember I was at a show in 2000 and I was like maybe 2020 or 2021 and I don't, you know, like we're friends and stuff and we visit a little bit here and there, but he comes over to me and he's like, what? I gotta know. He's like, just something just different. And, and, and he's like, what is it? He's like, there's something different. Something's working or are you doing something? I'm like, well, I just for the first time can afford to pay for like the RV lot, you know, at the horseshoe and stuff. And I'm not stressed out about doing good here to pay my bills.

And I mean, that just makes all the difference in the world and makes you like what you're doing a lot better and makes things a lot easier. Yeah, so we kind of the same way in 2019 sold a stud and that was really the first time we paid some real estate debt off that knowing what we know now, it was at like 2%. Free money. I was like, we need to meet that create. And now I'm like, well, dumb. That was the cheapest. We were just talking about this earlier in the day. We were talking about the bank loan and your money for, you know, even if it loans, it's 6%, but it's something you really, it's a piece of equipment. And then you can make a ton of money on it. That's free money. I know. We call that girl math. Yeah.

We call it girl math here. And so, yeah, I think in this horse deal, one thing I want to point out about what you guys said is, you know, you said, well, I was finally able to get ahead in 2019. Well, I'm just making an assumption that one reason you were probably able to somewhat get ahead is because you didn't have a brand new 10-horse bloomer, a brand new big truck pulling it, and big shiny things everywhere that you were just monstrously in debt on. You had kind of lived within your means. You obviously are going to have to get truck loans here and there, but you're going to. You're not you weren't trying to dig yourself out of a million dollar debt hole with 18 percent interest and that's one thing that i think that i could have been just as guilty of as any horse trainer is just like trying to keep up with the jones like you just are all the time trying to buy the bigger trailer the better trailer the bigger this the better that to try and look like you got it going on but they don't really care what you drive up and they want to see how much money you want yeah and like you see you have to have a safe rig and all that stuff but i mean i had i bought a new 10 wars trailer but i mean it was just a stock trailer with dividers and it was a four star and i bought it in 2010 still got it right and and i mean and you can power wash it put your tires on it it still looks pretty good it's everett merrick's welded it back together you know several times and fixed dividers and then all the deal in it but i still have it i you know and and uh the other it is carter likes it it's gonna be carter's yeah i call i call them a out of ship yeah and then the other one that we had a customer actually bought for me and i was able to ride that trailer off and that was robert tribemba he bought me another really nice 10 or similar on trailer and i was riding six seven horses for me at that time and you know i rode that trailer off and and no i mean it it's it's it's the truth i mean you need to have something that's safe that lets you get there but it's not about keeping up with the joneses and and uh and ultimately it's about affecting your craft yeah and that's what allowed you when you did have the opportunity to catch a breath and get ahead it's what allowed you.

To get ahead yeah i think that was with us the debt that we had was real estate and i always say like real estate that's probably fine you know unless you're buying it with 10 12 interest or something as long as you're being educated about it you buy some that you're gonna do well generally speaking on any kind of real estate purchase but we got same thing sold a horse was able to pay that off and that and i didn't want to sell that horse. I was like, no, I don't want to sell this stud. I like poured my life into it. And I just love, you know, whatever.

Yeah we're selling this we're selling this okay i don't care like we're partners but but i'm making an executive decision here you know and sometimes i get outvoted sometimes he gets outvoted and i let him outvote me on that one and thank goodness i did because that was like exactly what you said we're like this and it's fine but like that is what allowed us to get there to get over a comp to start really building at so much faster of a level which it sounds like that was kind of the same with you guys. And there is nothing that you can replace. I have to get up and hustle or I'm not going to feed my family, but also the comfort of knowing I can feed my family if I don't want at this horse show.

Maybe if I don't win all year, we might have a problem, but I can go in with the confidence right here and take a few risks to try to win instead of just... Make the finals yeah i just think that just that that breath of air was was pivotal i don't even know that the thought crossed my mind of the other stuff you know because i always like my wife said i just kind of go and do it and so there wasn't that thought of this may not work if this doesn't work but for me it just was like oh finally you know and i mean and then that made me i love what i do even now i mean that's it's all i want to do so so so it just allows me to like if i want and lease a load of cows to get more ready to go somewhere i don't think about it i just do it i i don't like i don't look at the price tag kind of the thing i just whatever is going to help me put myself in a better position to win or do better i'm gonna do it you know what i mean and and so so that that just really worked well i think something you've said there's really important about another thing we don't talk a lot about in the horse world is mental health and just like You just having that confidence and also having Becca's support to have that confidence to go and feel like you've got somebody behind you, backing you.

Because I think that the worst thing that you can have in any business is whoever your partner is pulling you the other way or holding you back or saying, I'm scared, no. And of course, you're more conservative, it sounds like. So you're the other person in the air that's like, just keep it in mind. She hates when I spend money. Yes. Let me tell you. But sometimes sports trainers got to handle. You got to put the eyebrow tight on. Yeah. Hold on a second. Don't do that. Yeah. He's never compulsive, which is, you know, I feel like he always has. A good vision for the risk he's taking sure you know he's yes we're not go like somebody asked where do you like to go on vacation i'm like we don't we don't you know but you know it's that's okay because we're both kind of driven the same way that when we're not at the horses we're glad to be home yeah and you know all kenny's got rolling his mind is what he's got coming up next the horses the two-year-olds so three you know all that stuff and i'm driven the same way like that's you know i'd rather have us at home where our livelihood is you know and so i feel like in that respect we we marry each other a lot and so when we're talking about a young trainer anybody that's in that the trenches that's in the grind that's like why am i not i mean like my account stays the same every month i felt like that's a thing that trainers get into like i just am surviving you know and i don't know what to do i think what you said was getting the right accountant and that person hopefully being enough of a horse person they don't have to be but enough of a horse person that they can help you get a set of books where you can say like yeah hey do you know that you're spending two hundred thousand a year on hay yeah you know i don't i mean i know when we've tried to talk and help some horse traders before we've been like hey your hay cost is way too high yep like we can immediate you don't have to ride any more horses let's just try and get your hay down and your shadings down and not get less your hay but let's try to contract the hay.

Yeah and i think that is like for me when i ask a young guy i'm like when they're talking about costs and stuff or you know how much they're not making any money whatever they're talking about i'm like what are you giving for your hay they're like well i'll give you know well i don't really know and i'm like well that's a good that's a problem because i mean if you're giving 200 a ton for your hay. Versus 350 a ton, I mean, that's the fastest money you're ever going to save. You know what I mean? Like you may, yeah, you may have to feed three by threes instead of small bales, but if it saves you 200 a ton and you're feeding, you know, 22 to 25 tons of hay a month, that's, that's a huge saving.

And for you guys and in the cutting your cat, you know, you plush the hay for your cattle. And so I think what a lot of those guys have to understand is like hey we don't need to go to the local feed store to buy our hay you know like we need to make it that volume that's not what that is designed for you know and so those guys learning to step back and talk to other people in the industry and not being afraid to come up to you and say explain this hay thing to me i don't understand you know how do i find hay or how do i contract it or calling ty or whatever i mean that's his thing not my thing but just figuring out like what are your fixed costs and maybe it's not that you need to go up on your training and maybe it's not that you need more courses or you need more more more maybe we just need to look at what we've got and draw back but you can't do that unless your books are right and so you've got to either have a becca at home that is billing correctly that's because that's important yes and her having a relationship just like with us where i'm like okay you know i think the one time i've texted you about something i'll be like hey this and you're like oh yeah it was just this this i'm I'm like, oh, great, no problem.

Send the check, you know, all good. But having that support at home for somebody that can handle that, because I think if I would have called you, you're not like, wow. You called the wrong department. Yeah, you're going to have to call the other department. And so if, You know, a horse trainer isn't married to somebody that's going to do that, then they've got to hire that out. And I think it's one thing is a lot of them try to do that themselves. And I think all of it is so the whole everything is so time consuming. And that's something what Kenny said in the interview. One of his interviews the other day was he feels like he has a great team to where his focus can be on. Absolutely. His job versus.

And he, you know, you manage like I tell you, hey, can you call her? Hey, guy, we need more hair. You know but so he and he manages the cow you know that's that price and stuff he manages that because he really is in tune with what get people to learn to do what i am either not good enough or don't have enough time to do and just like with you saying that and knowing yourself and knowing like because i tell people i'm like you know if we're not trying to cut hate costs like ride one more horse a month and pay somebody to do your bucks yeah i got that right there you know I mean, like, that's what it costs is basically one horse. Ride one extra horse a day, pull that off your plate, get it done right, and let somebody else do it.

Like, that is what you should do. And also, if you're spending two hours at night on it and stressing about it, it's like, that's not a good use of your time. And there is people out there that will do it. And I think that was something that I didn't really know as much as I'm like, who's going to do this? Yeah, you think it's impossible. But there is people that that is what they do. And they're good at it and they like it. Yeah, it's like people ask me, they're like, are you pretty mechanical savvy? Yeah, I am, but I'm not going to, I'm not a mechanic. So that's, so this is going to go to them because, you know, anyway, that, yeah, I grew, Yeah. And that's not to say that in the early stages when you're riding three courses, you need a full-fledged accountant, right?

Like, yeah, I think it's important for you to grind through some of that so you also understand how it works and you understand, you know, how to do it, even if it's just you by yourself as a horse trainer. But there definitely comes that point when you're like, okay, it's time. Time to grow out of a handwritten invoice. Exactly. Yeah, it's time to grow out of that. Now it's time to grow out of billing for me every month. Now it's time to grow into, I've got an accountant, they do the billing every month, they send me a T&L at the end of the month, whatever, and I kind of understand at any given time where I'm at. So, okay, so we'll move on from the money management, you know, all of that. I want to talk about MomStylish Blair. Man.

He's the OG. that's how i anytime i heard kenny platt it was most i was a player he just taught me how to win you know and i mean i bought that horse kind of because i liked those horses you know like that that mare that he's out of was just kind of famous mare and i loved some of those other ones like tim smith had my list babe and and and card trick always liked him he was always just a big cool looking stud and and i almost bought that horse as a yearling but he was so small i mean he was the size of like a weanling he sold for like 8 500 my wife would not let me buy we had to. Put together $10,000. Kenny was going to buy a yearling to bring back and sell a two-year-old. And it was a stretch for us to have $10,000 to do it.

And I think I spent $13,000 on. $12,000. I spent $12,000 on a horse called Smooth Flow that year. And Smooth Flow sold before Moe Establish Player. And I didn't have the $8,500 to buy Moe Establish Player, but a friend of mine named Lawson Hadlock bought him. And I'm just kind of checking up on him all the time. And he's like, hey, you should buy this horse from me. And so i was like well bring him to it was that next fall so it would have been september and uh he brought him to a little show up there in colorado that we shot loveland the loveland age event and he was riding him around and and i worked him and he didn't feel just unbelievable when i worked him but bob tergamo wanted a two-coming three-year-old and so we we bought him and and yeah he just was an unbelievable horse for me and really taught me how he really taught me how to win you know what i mean and he was kind of difficult to train and and all those things but man when he when he put it together about like about this time of this four-year-old year it just was it was he was unbelievable yeah do you think those horses that are like that that are maybe a little tougher to train are the ones that rise to the top yeah you know i mean i think that i i think yes i think there's some horses that you get that are that are real easy and and And then there's some that you get like that that aren't, and then they end up just.

Like, I think too hot to tag is a perfect example of that. I mean, he was difficult, you know what I mean, in a lot of different ways. But man, I mean, he just, once he really put it together, he's just been a machine. They kind of have to have that level of difficulty to be great for as long as that horse has been. I mean, I know he's just a five-year-old, but to not just peek at one show and then lose their fire. Yeah, because I think we see a lot of those horses that are easier and everybody's like, they're so great minded and so easy to train. And that is great. But, you know, you see those horses peak early in their four year old year and then they really just kind of lose some of their brightness and their non pro amateur horses and they just don't keep that.

Eyes bugged out grit yeah and it takes that now at the level you show i agree there's there's degrees of separation uh you know from from good to great now they're like and and that's to say too that those second tier horses almost as i would call them that maybe can still win at the open level but they're they're still great horses in their own right because 99 of people can't ride those too hot to task they can't manage or ride them yeah and so we you know people like me get to watch on the sidelines of those kind of great horses and see you manage and ride them and win and make them do these amazing things that just are freaking cool. Yeah. Me i i'm not going to get on him and replicate that you know like that is something that somebody that does it all day every day is and so point being that these other horses still have such an important place for the non-pros and amateurs oh yeah you know but i think it is interesting what you said there you know too much tag well those horses weren't the ones that you spent the least amount of time on oh man you know and but yeah when when people talk about tough to like those horses were a little more difficult because of the fact that they wanted to do it so bad you know what i mean or like lbr hangover that's all they want to do is is that so that's where when people talk about him being tough or whatever i i would say that you know toughness is more like hey not yet you know easy like like there's times i'll work those horses and or even i had a really nice girl named dr sewersh and you could not put your hand down when you were working him on the first cow because he was trying to squeal and just scatter and splatter everywhere.

Like, you know what I mean? You had to like keep him up like a pit bull on a chain. And so that's the toughness, I guess. That's the tough part about those horses is managing that part of it. I think tough horses to train are the ones that don't really want to do it. Those are the toughest because that's what you think. Yeah. Because then you're kind of kicking and begging and praying and, you know, And that part of it, I think those horses are very difficult. The ones like MomStyle is clearing out. They just took more time, took a lot more effort, took that. Just knowing that, hey, this horse is going to be great. You just have to get to that spot. You have to channel the greatness. Yeah, I got to get to that spot.

I think that's so cool to hear you say it like that because I think that's a great point. There is a lot of amateur and non-pro horses that are just good war horses. They don't wake up to cut every day, but they're just good horses. They wake up to cut, they do their jobs, and we appreciate it. Give them their bag of cookies afterwards. They're great. And then you have, and then there's some that, of course, don't make because they just don't want to do it. They might be out of the maturity champion by the maturity champ and they just, they know we're born with the love for it in their hearts, you know, and then you have. Tier level that i'm just gonna venture out there and say it sounds like you haven't had to try to make those horses cut you've done quite the opposite like whoa just easy yeah you know yeah it's been pretty been a pretty fun ride yeah and so okay so i want to talk a little bit and and so well let's finish mom stylish player where is he now at my house and he weighs he will live there for the reason yeah he weighs as much as a train car he's a big old but he's he uh he lives in the bottom where he's always lived he will never get outside he gets turned out with carter's first little pony and they're.

Buds and they you know and i still ride him and exercise him and but people always ask me when he gets to come back and have carter shell and i said we're not gonna do that too and he's you know it's he's earned his yeah and his you know he's a little overweight we just don't but he's sound and he's great we don't want to hurt him i'd probably show shot him yeah we talked about shotty in the game the other day but mom says flary's yeah he is really and he was a turning point of a horse you know his level and that's what i always thought about with kenny i never like i mean if he talks about where he wavered and decided about being a horse trainer i never wavered i'm like this is you have so much feel and talent and just you know he has a gift yeah i'm and i don't say stuff like that by the way i feel like it's it's a god-given gift and i always knew if you just stayed the course and you kept working the the horses of that level would eventually come and you know mom's house player we didn't buy him personally because i wouldn't like kenny because i'm like we don't even hardly have ten $10,000.

This horse is little. His toes stick to her now. You know, and I was in the industry of English horses, and I'm like, sometimes they don't grow. Yeah. It is possible. He could be this size next year. Because he's big. Yeah, he's beautiful. I remember him always telling him, like, stop, and he looks so good. Massive. Like, he just looks like his hip was a dog. It is. Yeah. But when he was, you know, at that sale, though, it was like, I think they forgot to fit him. There was some weird story. They thought he was something out of a different mare, but he wasn't. Yeah. So here he is, pot-bellied, a little sway back, toes turned out, and he looked like a runt. All these other beautiful yearlings. That's so funny.

It was. And then when we saw him as a two-year-old, that September's two-year-old year, I was like, that's Kenny's horse. You could just see him from, and I saw Kenny around, and I'm like, we're buying that horse. And, you know, Bob didn't pay a pot. I mean, he paid a very minimal. Yeah, looking back, it was nothing. Yeah, it was nothing at the time. At that time, it was a little bit, but yeah. You know, he just, he was just a special horse to us for now till forever, so. So I saw, I remember seeing you show that horse, and I wasn't super involved in the cutting that time, but you always heard that horse's name because he you just kicked the rear on him for a while there and then i remember what year would it have been that you showed shoddy at the maturity, 23 2023 yeah okay so 2022.

2022 i know i remember shawty yeah you know and and all year don telling us like oh my gosh i got this dual ratio that was dual ratio's first full profit you know don's dual ratio's biggest fan and he's like i got this one it's so great and it's so amazing it's so great and like you know we're like okay don we do the first 70 times you said it and he's like i really wish y'all would and I'm like, we are not buying a two-year-old. I don't care. That he is and he wasn't going to be cheap i was like no way because it's just too much money when you have one that's that good and so he kept like trying to get us i was like absolutely no nor can we afford it just to be clear like we just we're over here trying to build this place at that time and so we were a year off of buying this much like there ain't that freaking way and so he keeps telling us how great he is how great he is goes to the sale they po and he looks amazing in there I mean, his sale video was incredible.

It still made me one of my all-time favorite sale videos because that horse, like Chavo never touched him. He was just a cow. He was hungry. He looked hungry. He looked right. He had this big old eye like he does now. And so then I remember, I think, was it 2022, the year that you won the first go, the second go, the semis, and then you didn't have any luck in the finals? Yeah. Was it that year? yeah i had a horse called counting he was awesome yeah and i did i don't think i won i think i was i think i had a high composite coming back and he was amazing and then i won the semis and i was 25 in the semis on him and uh and i had another horse called roasting and i ended up being like in the top 10 on roasting and then my first cow i cut a cow everybody likes i was really in a set cut cow everybody liked it just didn't move and and uh but i marked like an 18 on him but yeah Yeah, that was. I remember that.

And I remember really cheering for that horse because he was so cool. He was. He was great. He was amazing. But whenever the maturity was over, I know I was, Ty and Don and I were on a call or something. We were together. Don's like, I think I'm going to send that horse to Kenny. Yeah. I just think Kenny's hungry for it. Yeah. Like, he's like, he's hungry. Like, he was so close on him this year. Yeah. And I just think he's hungry for it. Yeah. And so, he sent that horse. Yep. So tell us kind of the story from your point of view. Man, he texted me. Hey, this is Don Ham. I got a horse in the sand. Did you know him before you? Yeah, a little bit, you know, but not, yeah, just enough to kind of say hello to you.

And he texted me that horse to sell video, the number, and he's like, hey, check this horse out. You know, I'm curious if you'd be interested to ride this horse for me. And I kind of thought it was somebody, you know, I was like, okay, it's because of that video. I'm like, I don't need to go. Didn't you say she'd sent you the video? Yeah, my wife had sent me the video before the show started. And so, you know, of course, I'm like, yeah, I'd love to ride that horse, you know, but But you got to understand, and I don't mean this in a negative way, but people call me all the time and they send me videos and they're like, hey, if this one doesn't sell. And I mean, if every one of those people actually sent me a horse, I would run out of stalls people.

It never usually works out, you know, especially around that time of year, because people are going to mail in one different directions. And they're more or less just wanting to feel you out to see what, you know, I get the question, how many do you have? And he never asked me about it. And he just asked me about riding that horse. And I was like, yeah, of course, I'd love to have that horse. And then because I had been through that enough, I kind of forgot all about it. And then when they PO'd him, I guess that was after they PO'd him. And then he contacted me a little bit later after that conversation. And yeah, I picked him up at the fraternity and stuff like that. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, when they PO'd him, at least on social media side, they went crazy.

Yeah. I can't believe he owed that horse. And Charles is the one person that can do that, and nobody would be surprised. Yeah. Because Charles is like, I don't care. I need your money. This horse is awesome. If you want to pay me at a price, I'll take it. But otherwise, it's my turn, people. And so, you know, that was the, I think it's so funny how everything just falls into play. It's supposed to work. It's supposed to work. And so then you get that horse's three-year-old. And I remember at one point you telling me, well, I didn't have anything to do with him as a three-year-old, right? So Charles and Don owned him. And Don kept calling us and saying like, man, he's freaking awesome. Like this horse is unreal and unbelievable and this and that.

And then, you know, you guys go to the maturity and he's like, that horse was so good. It just didn't work. you know it just it wasn't his time it just didn't work yeah i was i was kind of later on in the set on him and i cut this cow that we liked and i mean it just basically runs him over like the first turn my first cow and i'm gonna work at like two turns and it kind of runs me over and i quit and i marked a 12 to 12 on him and the next two cows i cut he was really good and i'm thinking okay, I'm going to make it back on this horse. And I know on the second round, I could put a run together and make it back. I mark a 12. Take a 13. The whole time, it looks like it's going to take that 12.

But I was on the first day, I think, or the first or the second day, but I was early. And as it went on, people were marking 13s because that's how it goes. And I'm not making a chop of the judging. I'm not saying anything, but that's how it goes. Everything just gets a little- It's just so long. Yeah, and they're watching three-year-olds not get through runs. And so these 13s are popping up. And I'm like, my run was two points better than that one. But I, and, and right when that started happening, I'm like, I'm not going to make it back on this horse. That's just how it's going to go. And, uh, I come back to the super stakes, this four year old year, and I'm saying deep in a set and I cut a cow that just had acted really, really good.

And I mean, I don't even know that I got my hand down before I got run over on him. And he'd been really good at the cattleman's and some, several of his other shows in between and next show I... Do good on it but the bi but i draw a last on but the our son in the fall yeah terrible but i did good on in there like you know i marked some good scores around next shot go to the june vegas show and he's unbelievable i marked like a 29 on him in the finals it's one of the best i remember yeah it's one of the best it was right when we bought it was yeah we were right in the middle of it before vegas and i think we're like charles is he's going back out now yeah exactly yeah anyway But I marked the 29 on there and then, and the next show is the Derby and I cut my first cow.

He is as good as he could possibly be on my first cow. And I'm like, go to cut my second cow. And a cow just kind of breaks from the one that I'm cutting and he took it and I couldn't get him steered back around to get cut my, it just is a, and so then everybody, and this is what I, this is the one thing that I, I didn't. I think good about my mentality is everybody from that home is like, well, you're just snake bit on that horse in Fort Worth. And I'm like, no, I'm not. No, that's not how that works. You know, that's not how that works. And then to come back and, and do as good on him and John Justin as I did, but I was still like, I really died and want to get back in that big pen with this horse.

Cause I want to get one title on in there and, and make the finals on him. And, and that was what was so cool about this. And you did. Yeah. That was what was so cool about this last win was, was getting that on him because I, I don't believe in that. Shit yeah like i mean you can't you know even mom's stylish player he ran off in the semis in the fraternity and hey listen he doesn't eat check up like this horse i hit one one one stop and one turn to the left and that was it and i've got my hand down and the cow breaks it and this horse sells out oh my god and everybody's like not good job sir but i think that's just because of the fact that we didn't know that we had to put earplugs in it.

But after after that everybody everybody has their theory you know and they're like that you know the old school theory is that a force runs off in fort worth it just keeps running that's what kenny told me i said i said i don't like that i remember i remember thinking that that night people were kind of saying that you know that's just i'm not saying that it's not how it's gonna go like i'm not i'm not ready not ready for that to be like the final fate you know what I mean? Like, any rate. And that at the super stakes on Mom's House Player, I just kept thinking, turn every time. And then he marks that, he marked a 26 in the first round on Mom's House Player. And it was just like a sire league. That's just like shoddy last year at the Super Stakes when he marked that 26 in the first round.

And I remember talking to Marie, and we were just getting to know Marie. And I'm like, this is the first time he advanced from the first round. And she's like, what? I'm like, we've just had, you know, just the dumbest things happen. So just to have that, that it's, you know, that's a really. I remember at some point you telling me a story about, And it was probably after these hiccups at the Fort Worth and you got on them one day and you said, look, buddy, you're all I got and I'm all you got. So we're going to have to figure this out. And I thought that was funny, you know, to just that. And that's the truth. Sometimes you just got it. You got to get your mind right. Yeah. And not that it wasn't, but you got to get your mind right and make sure that it's your job as a horse trainer to make sure that horse's mind is right. 100%. And get with them.

You know, I call it getting with them. You know what I mean? And when you have a great horse or even a good horse and you get with them, it's going to work out a lot better. You know what I mean? And I think I want to talk a little bit about, you know, we've talked about customers and their expectations. And having Don there through that four-year-old year to give you the space to, to do your thing without you feeling maybe you still did feel that pressure i mean of course you did but yeah i think i feel pressure in different ways i mean i don't i just don't want to let people down that are that are that are invested in me you know what i mean i mean i'm like we're talking about earlier like i think people they know that i'm entered up that i want to win and i want to do good and and and i don't ever want them thinking anything but that i don't want them ever thinking that it's not on my mind to do good and and don was always awesome like that like, he you know he never wavered in that part of it and and that horse would show glimpses at those other previous prior shows and i had some really good runs on him and that helped a lot but but yeah i mean you know he's the reason i got that horse and and to me that i didn't take that lightly you know what i mean there was a lot of other people that had won a lot more than me that could have got him and they didn't and i got him and i think that that that's the pressure i felt was i don't want to let him down right here you know what i mean and uh it's a.

One thing I was thinking about earlier is you said, you know, no different than that or the part of the point in time where you said you sold the hottest. Mm-hmm. My life is hot, yeah. You know, you went and reinvested that money right back into what you were doing and made it multiply. And that is so important to get to staying ahead. Yeah. Right? So, like, you did kind of get ahead when you were seventh in the maturity. Not in the way that you did in 2020 or 2019 when you sold that stud, but those are the steps that like when you get that opportunity, you've got to take it and make the most of those little steps that can push you to the next level. I call it doubling down. Yes, that's exactly right. If something goes good, you really kind of need to double down.

I mean, within reason. I understand. You don't need to be an idiot. Right. But if you know your business and you're taking a strong interest in your business, you're not going to make bad decisions by buying back in or doubling down on things. Well, and I think a lot of people, too, think like, oh, they listen to all this stuff and I need to... You know, invest my money in this or that. Well, there's, for a long time, the best money you can invest is in yourself. Yeah. Why would you not bet on yourself? Why are you going to go bet on the stock market? Bet on even 10 grand. It's not going to change your life. Our accountant told us that we were, I was talking about, you know, money at the end of the year, what we do, and we were talking about.

You know, retirement fund, you know, so that it's the best tax benefits we could. And she looked through all of it and she said, you know what Kenny needs to do? And i'm like getting ready for this she's like tell him to take that money and put it into a horse that he can make more money on because she said that's his business that's what he knows the best and the return is going to be better that way than if you put it into some ira she said you know and she told me that she's like that's kenny's business and that's what he is so good at do that and you know she understands the business she understands you know the agricultural business and she was very you know and i always will just pose those questions if you recall i'm like okay rachel tell us this tell us that direct us here and i remember that's what she said she's like he needs to keep investing in himself because that's his business that's how he's you know just step by step kind of inched along and gotten ahead little by little and she said tell him take that money and make it more money and so i think that yeah it's like you said it's It's what you know.

At this age, like at all of this stage in our life, I think it's, you can put your money, you know, if you put, you could max out your IRA as far as what you get in it tax-free, which is not a lot. You can put a little bit in it every year tax-free and there's something wrong with that. And it's probably an okay plan, but getting a hundred grand ahead on a horse and putting that in the stock market. I think that's a bad idea. Why? You know what we can do if we have the right horses and we can insure those horses. And yeah, it could go bad, but stock market we've been to you know so when you think you know of the future for you guys and like what what is your next goal. Uh, you know, I mean, my financial freedom, you know, I mean, that's, that's, that's always the, the kind of the main goal, financial freedom for sure.

And then I really like, I really do like raising these horses, you know, like even being third on the gelden that we raised the other night was, that's a cool thing for, for, for me. But, you know, I mean, the, the goal is just to be the best. I mean, like your sign, it says solo, the very best. Like i think the goal is to be the best and that's that's you don't get to you don't get to have that very long you know what i mean and and it's usually you know when you're at the top then you just get knocked back down again and you know you're just i think but that that's the goal for for me and everybody be like everybody will be like they'll hear this and be like well yeah you know you are well not no because there's still people that have born more than me sure there's there's still people that have probably a better three-year-old than I have maybe you know there's always that that level of competition and and yeah staying at the top of my game is saying is sometimes harder than getting there it's that's like Mike Tyson used to say that the hardest part about being a champ is not not not being a champ stay in the champ and that's very difficult and it's hard to you know when you start climbing and getting at the top you lose a lot of the cheerleaders you had on the way up oh yeah yeah I've tagged rice told me one time He said.

Because he went on a pretty good tear there for, you know, several years and tags amazing. But he told me one time that people started showing up, you know. 15, 10, 15 years ago to make sure that he didn't do good. And they're almost cheering when he did bad. And he said, now they're cheering for me again. But he said, I remember that story. And I think about that. Yeah, I mean, people don't want to, you know, everybody hates a winner. You know what I mean? And that part of it. But also, too, I think that that's a compliment in itself. I mean, the fact that people don't like Patrick Mahomes or don't like Tom Brady or don't like those kind of people like that, I think is insane. Because they're the they're the greatest you know like Tom Brady well lots of people yeah but but you know I yeah like you said you lose cheerleaders and stuff like that but uh you know I mean ultimately you're not doing it for them anyway yeah you know you're doing it for these people, and and what I want to end this with and I want both of y'all to answer this question What is, what would you tell your younger self 20 years ago if you could today?

Oh, I mean, several things. One of them is buy some stock and apple. But I would really, I would tell my younger self to buy a miracle biscuit love. That I could have bought for $2,500, but I didn't have the money because when I saw her at the horse show, I had already gotten rid of the saddle to be there. And, you know, I would have borrowed money from my mom and aunt, whatever. And so I would have invested more in horses and mares that I could have bought and things like that. I would have invested way more in that. And I think I could have gotten more financially ahead sooner. But that being said it was probably a good thing for me to have no money and be stressed and keep my eye on the prize so you know you got to be we got to watch going backwards sometimes and thinking too much about that i think i'm real grateful to have struggled and gotten my ass kicked and i had customers tell me i suck and have people take horses from me because they didn't feel like i was good enough and and lose cows at the futuri the year before i won it with two seconds left on the clock and and then come back the next year and win and i'm i'm grateful for the struggle i think it's uh you're you're uh you're blessed if you get to struggle because then you really get to appreciate it when it goes good so yeah yeah i don't think i'd yeah i think the struggle, all the ups and downs and it's a gift you know i feel like everything we have everything these horses it's all a gift and the fact that we get to live this life and you know i never dreamed of want to do anything else and so to still have that as the central part of our life even though not a single ounce of it has been easy you know i i feel like people don't realize that you know we've we have struggled and it's been a slow grind 20 years of a slow grind yeah you know and, but yeah we wouldn't change one part of it i don't think you know it's.

It's just been a fantastic ride. We're going to keep plugging. But that's why I just thought, no, it's like people talk about, you know, just kind of act like it's just all there. And it's like, no, it's every day. It's another day. You know, I feel like Kenny does not rest. Like he's out there. You know, we're here through the rest of this week because Carter's going to show him the circuit finals on the weekend. And we've run three trailers back north colorado to get all the three girls here because if someone were at home can he be fretting about the fact that he's missing time on his next set of horses so i just feel like the grind's not over the hardship isn't over you just you know you can't necessarily look too far ahead you just have to you know sometimes you just take it day by day but i feel like that's the that's kind of the beauty of it you know we just have enjoyed every ounce of the struggle and it's a great thing to be you know to have the horse together just been a blessing from the very get-go to now you know we've we've had some even if they aren't famous horses you know we've had some special horses all along the way that have just kind of kept it's like they just kind of kept kenny reaching like yes you know we've we have a an old mare for hank and karen true she's 21 or 22 now and she was one of kind of the first you know original sets of horses that came to Kenny, and she'll live at our house till the day she's, you know, her last breath.

And, you know, I try to like tell the girls about her and, you. She was a really physical, tough, cool mare, and nobody knows her because we showed her at a small level. But the fact that we still have her, you know, like I go out to our mare barn every night, and I give her cookies every night, and, you know, it's stuff like that that it's really special, you know, to us. And I feel like we don't take it for granted with these horses that we've been so blessed to have because, boy, they've just made the time go fast, you know, they've just helped us keep going. Thank you. Okay, Carter, you're up. Okay. How do you feel about showing in a couple days? I feel so good. What horse are you showing?

Sue Sohott. Okay, tell us about Sue Sohott. She's an honest mare, full sister to Dr. Sue. My dad's been, I've been getting her ready for my dad to work every morning. She's been really good, and I have a good feeling about her, so. Good, good. Okay. What do you think it takes to be the best horse trainer? Just years and years of hard work. I don't really know what the saving size is. What do you think that your dad is the best at? Him. Not letting his nerves get in. That's a good one. Because I was nervous the other night. I mean, I was really nervous. Oh, I was nervous.

We all wore a towel and I was like, that was good. And then he like trotted on her and I was like, okay, here we go. Oh my God. That was a fast one. He's just like, Boom, hand down, let's go. Well, I just, like, I don't really know how to say it. I just, I get, trust me, I get nervous. I probably get more nervous when he's in the finals than when I am.

What do you think makes Shadi so special? He's just, I don't even know. No, he just is, he's something you don't get often. Something that doesn't come often. Like horses like him, animals like him, they don't come often. So we just, we can't take it for granted. So that's right. That's exactly right. We can't take it for granted. And I'm very curious about your answer to this. What do you want to be when you grow up? I figured. I just had to ask. Well, thank you guys so much for coming on today. You guys have a great story. And hopefully this gives some insight, you know, to people that are trying to get the business, whether it's they're trying to become a horse trainer or go to work at a breeding facility or, you know, it can apply to any, whether you want to own your own business or you're going to work for somebody, whatever it comes out to just, I think the principles here are all the same.

So thank you guys for your time. Thank you for taking such great care of Shoddy and riding him and loving him like he's yours. Thank you for the opportunity. We are just so, we feel very lucky to have had all of this work out for you guys to be his people. And we're going to do the best we can to be the best stewards of his breeding career and try to make sure that he has every chance beyond the sire that we think that he is. So we're excited about the ride and I'm sure we'll have you guys on again one day whenever Carter wins the paternity. Want his three-year-old that's what that's all the shockers that's right we're breeding some right now just for you so when carter wins the maturity on a three-year-old we'll be sitting right back here and talking about how great shot he was and the fun stories that come with the three-year-old he wins the maturity on so we're excited and looking forward to it and thanks again to the run on guys thank you thank you.